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Opiate/opiode Potentiators


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Just been browsing around this forum to see if any topics had been made about the use of potentiators while using opiates to increase their effect/duration. I'm not talking like alcohol and benzo's, as they dont potentiate, they just add another buzz to the original effect, i mean items that actually increase the potency of the original opiate. I'm a firm beleiver in taking Tagamet about an hour before consuming Hydro, Oxy or and of the other opiates (aside from codeine, it actually inhibits that one.

I am trying to find a very old post on potentiators that was really well written, with the actual science behind why these work. I will post it later today when i locate it.

I would really like to hear everyone elses thoughts on the use of these.

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Ok, found the post. It's rather long, but has a huge amount of information, what to use as potentiators, and why.

That said, to get the ABSOLUTE MOST out of your opiate, try N0 W4RN1NG's patented opioid potentiation formula: (note * T-45, T-35 etc etc refers to the time before you injest the opiate)

* T-45) 600mg Tagamet HB(Cimetidine HCl), a large glass of tonic water (or another source of quinine), and a large glass of (white) Grapefruit juice, preferably from concentrate.

* T-35) 30mg DXM HBr, 4mg CPM, 25mg Benadryl(Diphenhydramine HCl), 330mg Naproxen(Aleve).

* T-20) 2 Tums OR 1.5 Tbsp. of Baking SODA. (Obviously this step only applies if you are eating your opes)

* T-0) Parachutechewrailbang your opiateopioid.

In depth explanation:

The Tagamet HB (Cimetidine) is a broad CYP450 inhibitor. This basically means it 'clogs' the enzymes that metabolize opiatesopioids and clear 'em out of the body. Tagamet HB tablets are 200mg each, so the recommended 600mg is 3 tabs. They're OTC, and you can get a box of 50 generic 200mg cimetidine tabs at CVS for like $5.49.

Quinine is an ingredient in tonic water, and functions the same way as Tagamet. It inhibits the CYP450 set, more specifically, CYP2D6. It doesn't 'clog' as many enzymes as Tagamet does, but it STRONGLY 'clogs' CYP2D6, which is the MAIN enzyme for opiates like oxycodone, heroin, hydromorphone, etc. A large glass of straight tonic water is plenty. I prefer the "Vintage" brand. You can buy a liter of tonic water at any grocery for like $2.00.

White grapefruit juice contains three ingredients that clog the CYP450 set. However, it doesn't clog CYP2D6 too well, which is the main one for most opes. It does strongly 'clog' CYP3A4 nicely though, and although that's almost an 'auxillary' enzyme for alot of opiates, it definitely helps out. Again, it's cheap. Go to any grocery store and you should be able to get a nice big bottle of 100% whitre grapefruit juice from concentrate for like $2.50-$3.50.

An important thing to note for the grapefruit juice is the percentage of juice. A lot of companies make "White grapefruit juice" that is basically water, corn syrup, and like 10% juice. This is almost a waste of your money. You want it to say 100% juice, and also, you want to make sure it's 100% white grapefruit juice! A very common business practice for juice companies is to create 'juice cocktails'. These are beverages that are MAINLY cheap filler juices like apple and pear, with the advertised fruit only partially accounting for that '100% juice' the bottle sports so vividly. Look in the ingredients list, and make sure the only juice in there is white grapefruit, preferably from concentrate.

Nutritionally, juices from concentrate are usually not as good. However, for one reason or another, grapefruit juice from concentrate can contain 25%-40% MORE naringin, bergamottin and dihydroxybergamottin; the three enzyme inhibitors present in white grapefruit.

Now, some of you may be wondering WHY 'clogging' these enzymes is so beneficial. Basically, by slowing or even completely stopping the metabolization of opiates, they last MUCH longer. Also, blood plasma levels of opiates have been shown to vastly higher when the CYP450 set is strongly inhibited; meaning their is a higher peak, and it lasts longer.

It's a win-win situation, trust me. ^_^

On to the other shit. Benadryl(diphenhydramine HCl) and CPM(chlorpheniramine maleate) are both over-the-counter anti-histamines that increase the analgesic and euphoric properties of opiates to some extent. They also help cut down on the ope-itch. In addition, these guys also slightly inhibit subset CYP2D6.

Seeing a pattern here?

DXM (Dextromethorphan HBr, Robitussin, Zicam, etc.[not that it needed an intro on this board]) has a special effect in this formula. Although it doesn't inhibit the CYP450 set to any appreciable extent, it does contribute to analgesia and euphoria for all major opiates. Also, it has been shown to prevent the build up of tolerance! 30mg of DXM a good half hour or so before dosing will definitely slow any tolerance build up if you use this method every time. And with opiates, that's a VERY big deal.

The Naproxen(Aleve) adds to the analgesia and euphoria. Aleve comes in 220mg tabs, so by 330mg I mean one-and-a-half tabs.

The tumsbaking soda is only necessary if you're eating the opiates in question. Basically, they lower the PH of the stomachGI tract [well, technically it raises the PH, but ya know what I mean] which allows more of the opiate to be absorbed into the blood.

It's fine to smoke a little bud, but too much ruins the high IMO. And when I say a little, I mean like .2g, tops. If you have a moster tolerance, titrate accordingly, but if you smoke a few times a week .3 will be perfect.

To further breakdown all this pre-dose potentiation, I'll make it easy for you guys and just tell ya how many pills to take, and the exact way I consume them (note * T-45, T-35 etc etc refers to the time before you injest the opiate

* T-45) 3 200mg Cimetidine pills, washed down with a HUGE tonic waterwhite grapefruit juice cocktail.

* T-35) 1 Coriciden Cough & Cold Low Blood Pressure, 1 Benadryl, and one and a half Aleve.

* T-20) 2 extra strength Tums if I'm popping the opes.

* T-0) Railpop those shits.

The Coriciden has both 30mg of DXM and 4 mg of CPM, so it's good for killin' 2 birds with one stone. No pun intended.

Also, some people are under the impression that all these drugs make the high "dirty". They CAN, no doubt about it, but in the dosages I listed, there are *NO* perceived changes in the quality of the high. It really does feel like you took more opiate, minus some itching.

Anyway, that's basically it! Hope I manage to help some of you guys out on your voyages to the land of nod, and if you have any questions, feel free to post.

And if this is too lengthy, it's because I'm yakked out of my skull PLUS 48mg hydromorphone; preloaded, of course, with my all-powerful formula.

...and I'm procrastinating for a paper due tomorrow morning. But that's besides the point. Peace!

N0 W4RN1NG

EDIT: Forgot to mention:

This formula should NOT be used in combination with codeine. Codeine's pleasurable effects are largely dependant on it's metabolization into morphine via CYP450 subsets. This formula basically fucks that shit up the ass. If you're using codeine, just take the DXM.

Also, if you plan on drinking alcohol, nix the Aleve. It can cause some nasty damage to your stomach in combo with alcohol. Same goes for APAPTylenol(acetaminophen), so if you're taking opiates with tylenol included (Vicoden, Percoset, Endocet, Tylenol 3, etc) be nice to your liver and don't drink. Liver failure is no picnic, mkay?"

-Once again...I did not write this guide.

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I know it was a long post, but hopefully some of you will take the time to read it, and maybe even post your experiences as well.

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That's cool. I've never tried it. How much do you really think it helps tho? Example I take 2 xyz. 10-15 minutes later I'm buzzing nicely. For nezt few hours I'm really nice but not buzzed. More mellow. How would this affect me? Would the buzzy high last longer? The mellow l? Just curious although how much trouble could it be to get grapefruit juice, tonic and anti poop meds? I should just take a day to experiment

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Also - wouldn't the Tagamet cause major work stoppage? This can be a problem anyway for the opiate dependent.

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That's cool. I've never tried it. How much do you really think it helps tho? Example I take 2 xyz. 10-15 minutes later I'm buzzing nicely. For nezt few hours I'm really nice but not buzzed. More mellow. How would this affect me? Would the buzzy high last longer? The mellow l? Just curious although how much trouble could it be to get grapefruit juice, tonic and anti poop meds? I should just take a day to experiment

as for longer.

i know it was a bit to read through, but the gist of it is, when using opiates, there are receptors in the brain that the opiate chemicals attach to. The tagamet uses those same receptors in the brain that the opiates use. By using the tagamet to block those receptors, the opiates have no where to return, so they just bounce around until the receptors are finally cleared whent the tagamet wears off. This makes the time the opiates have to give you you pain releif/buzz whatever a longer life span as they are waiting for their "home port" to become available.

as for the higher strentgh, that comes from the anitihistimes and the robitussun. It is not a huge jump.

The whole process takes a while, and to be honest, alot of times i just use the tagamet when in a hurry, just to prolong the effects.

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Also - wouldn't the Tagamet cause major work stoppage? This can be a problem anyway for the opiate dependent.

Not sure about the "work stoppage" ive read up quite a bit on it and it doesnt seem to have any uses pertaining to certain "movements. Aslo note the the times listed have to be followed.

I have used this numueros times. I'm not gong to sit here and tell you it doubles or triples the effect., but just by using the tagamet and tonicwater/grapefruit juice ive found about a 30% increase in duration. whith the other ingredients i have found mild increases in potency, but not nearly as high as the increase in duration.

For me, its just a money saver if nothing else, you can take 2 of you prefered doses, and it will last as long as 3. Please do not just take my word for it, although i PROMISE i have used this numerous times, use goole, the info is out there

If you are worried about trying to gatter all the ingredients, just grabe the gratefruit juice and tagamet. Total price for a box and a bottle is abou 6 bucks

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I only take codeine or dihydrocodeine, I find the best way to potentiate is take them on an empty stomach and take a 50mg cyclizine. I take them both orally at the same time. I personally don't take anything stronger but I've read that cyclizine works well with other opiates, especially methadone. I'm in the UK and cyclizine is technically otc, but It's near impossible to find a pharmacy who'll sell it to you, unfortunately.

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Ok, so I have NEVER heard this potentiation conversation before epk brought it up in another forum (I know you took a little flack for bringing it up over there but it was worth it so thanks to ya). I started researching it a bit, as suggested, and then ran to the store for some white grapefruit juice. Already had some of the other stuff. Love doing mini research studies lol. I'll keep you posted ;) ..Check out this poll I came across whilst googling:

http://forum.opiophile.org/showthread.php?6181-Favorite-opiate-potentiator

Thanks again e

~ S

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Ok, found the post. It's rather long, but has a huge amount of information, what to use as potentiators, and why.

That said, to get the ABSOLUTE MOST out of your opiate, try N0 W4RN1NG's patented opioid potentiation formula: (note * T-45, T-35 etc etc refers to the time before you injest the opiate)

* T-45) 600mg Tagamet HB(Cimetidine HCl), a large glass of tonic water (or another source of quinine), and a large glass of (white) Grapefruit juice, preferably from concentrate.

* T-35) 30mg DXM HBr, 4mg CPM, 25mg Benadryl(Diphenhydramine HCl), 330mg Naproxen(Aleve).

* T-20) 2 Tums OR 1.5 Tbsp. of Baking SODA. (Obviously this step only applies if you are eating your opes)

* T-0) Parachutechewrailbang your opiateopioid.

In depth explanation:

The Tagamet HB (Cimetidine) is a broad CYP450 inhibitor. This basically means it 'clogs' the enzymes that metabolize opiatesopioids and clear 'em out of the body. Tagamet HB tablets are 200mg each, so the recommended 600mg is 3 tabs. They're OTC, and you can get a box of 50 generic 200mg cimetidine tabs at CVS for like $5.49.

Quinine is an ingredient in tonic water, and functions the same way as Tagamet. It inhibits the CYP450 set, more specifically, CYP2D6. It doesn't 'clog' as many enzymes as Tagamet does, but it STRONGLY 'clogs' CYP2D6, which is the MAIN enzyme for opiates like oxycodone, heroin, hydromorphone, etc. A large glass of straight tonic water is plenty. I prefer the "Vintage" brand. You can buy a liter of tonic water at any grocery for like $2.00.

White grapefruit juice contains three ingredients that clog the CYP450 set. However, it doesn't clog CYP2D6 too well, which is the main one for most opes. It does strongly 'clog' CYP3A4 nicely though, and although that's almost an 'auxillary' enzyme for alot of opiates, it definitely helps out. Again, it's cheap. Go to any grocery store and you should be able to get a nice big bottle of 100% whitre grapefruit juice from concentrate for like $2.50-$3.50.

An important thing to note for the grapefruit juice is the percentage of juice. A lot of companies make "White grapefruit juice" that is basically water, corn syrup, and like 10% juice. This is almost a waste of your money. You want it to say 100% juice, and also, you want to make sure it's 100% white grapefruit juice! A very common business practice for juice companies is to create 'juice cocktails'. These are beverages that are MAINLY cheap filler juices like apple and pear, with the advertised fruit only partially accounting for that '100% juice' the bottle sports so vividly. Look in the ingredients list, and make sure the only juice in there is white grapefruit, preferably from concentrate.

Nutritionally, juices from concentrate are usually not as good. However, for one reason or another, grapefruit juice from concentrate can contain 25%-40% MORE naringin, bergamottin and dihydroxybergamottin; the three enzyme inhibitors present in white grapefruit.

Now, some of you may be wondering WHY 'clogging' these enzymes is so beneficial. Basically, by slowing or even completely stopping the metabolization of opiates, they last MUCH longer. Also, blood plasma levels of opiates have been shown to vastly higher when the CYP450 set is strongly inhibited; meaning their is a higher peak, and it lasts longer.

It's a win-win situation, trust me. ^_^

On to the other shit. Benadryl(diphenhydramine HCl) and CPM(chlorpheniramine maleate) are both over-the-counter anti-histamines that increase the analgesic and euphoric properties of opiates to some extent. They also help cut down on the ope-itch. In addition, these guys also slightly inhibit subset CYP2D6.

Seeing a pattern here?

DXM (Dextromethorphan HBr, Robitussin, Zicam, etc.[not that it needed an intro on this board]) has a special effect in this formula. Although it doesn't inhibit the CYP450 set to any appreciable extent, it does contribute to analgesia and euphoria for all major opiates. Also, it has been shown to prevent the build up of tolerance! 30mg of DXM a good half hour or so before dosing will definitely slow any tolerance build up if you use this method every time. And with opiates, that's a VERY big deal.

The Naproxen(Aleve) adds to the analgesia and euphoria. Aleve comes in 220mg tabs, so by 330mg I mean one-and-a-half tabs.

The tumsbaking soda is only necessary if you're eating the opiates in question. Basically, they lower the PH of the stomachGI tract [well, technically it raises the PH, but ya know what I mean] which allows more of the opiate to be absorbed into the blood.

It's fine to smoke a little bud, but too much ruins the high IMO. And when I say a little, I mean like .2g, tops. If you have a moster tolerance, titrate accordingly, but if you smoke a few times a week .3 will be perfect.

To further breakdown all this pre-dose potentiation, I'll make it easy for you guys and just tell ya how many pills to take, and the exact way I consume them (note * T-45, T-35 etc etc refers to the time before you injest the opiate

* T-45) 3 200mg Cimetidine pills, washed down with a HUGE tonic waterwhite grapefruit juice cocktail.

* T-35) 1 Coriciden Cough & Cold Low Blood Pressure, 1 Benadryl, and one and a half Aleve.

* T-20) 2 extra strength Tums if I'm popping the opes.

* T-0) Railpop those shits.

The Coriciden has both 30mg of DXM and 4 mg of CPM, so it's good for killin' 2 birds with one stone. No pun intended.

Also, some people are under the impression that all these drugs make the high "dirty". They CAN, no doubt about it, but in the dosages I listed, there are *NO* perceived changes in the quality of the high. It really does feel like you took more opiate, minus some itching.

Anyway, that's basically it! Hope I manage to help some of you guys out on your voyages to the land of nod, and if you have any questions, feel free to post.

And if this is too lengthy, it's because I'm yakked out of my skull PLUS 48mg hydromorphone; preloaded, of course, with my all-powerful formula.

...and I'm procrastinating for a paper due tomorrow morning. But that's besides the point. Peace!

N0 W4RN1NG

EDIT: Forgot to mention:

This formula should NOT be used in combination with codeine. Codeine's pleasurable effects are largely dependant on it's metabolization into morphine via CYP450 subsets. This formula basically fucks that shit up the ass. If you're using codeine, just take the DXM.

Also, if you plan on drinking alcohol, nix the Aleve. It can cause some nasty damage to your stomach in combo with alcohol. Same goes for APAPTylenol(acetaminophen), so if you're taking opiates with tylenol included (Vicoden, Percoset, Endocet, Tylenol 3, etc) be nice to your liver and don't drink. Liver failure is no picnic, mkay?"

-Once again...I did not write this guide.

this wont work for vicodin either, hydro is metabolized by the liver enzyme into hydromorphone

i know this because i take a ssri that blocks tthat cyp thing and it basically inactivates hydrocodone u have to

take like 3x more to get the same effect its bullshit lol i had a surgery i was given norcos andthey didnt even

make me sleepy complained to the doc he expalined the ssri fucked up the metabolism

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With codeine I sometimes take Benadryl,potentiates a little and helps with the itching .

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dxm 45mg seems to work, i was a heavy abuser of dxm in the past so i am surprised it actually worked

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damn. quinone, grapefruit juice, cimetidine, dxm, chlorpheniramine maleate, And benadryl. So many things... I feel like it would be dangerous to use the entire combo and IV anything strong, like heroin. With someone really trying to get the most out of some prescription opioids, it makes sense. I want to try it, but I only really IV opiates when I use them. I'll probably try a lighter version - like just grapefruit juice OR tonic water, and CPM/Benadryl - no dxm/cimetidine.

I'm actually a fan of CPM & benadryl, because with some good shit you're going to be itching your face off without it.

I think if anything would make the high "dirty", it would be the DXM. Benadryl and CPM might make you more tired, but let's face it, you weren't exactly planning to be hyper anyways ;)

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Never IV'd anything personally, but ive heard injecting cyclizine (not sure if its IV or IM) with heroin is pretty full on, if your into that sort of thing. And it should also help with any itching

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taking opiate with fioricet is great if ur running low on "medicine" fioricet is easy to get from any walk-in clinic place

just say ur having a migrane and thats what u normally take. if u say u take SSRI there isnt much else they can give for a migrane because its theonly one that doesnt interact with SSRI

be careful tho it contains some kind of barbituate so it can be dangerous to take in combo with opiates,small dose of both

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